Im curious to know the difference in velocity between a 5 and 6 inch barrel (a 1911) when using the real 10mm rounds- Double Tap, very hot handloads. The wheels are about to start turning on a little project of mine that Ive been wanting to do for a while: A 10mm built on an STI 2011 frame service-sidearm style. Im concerned about the draw characteristics of a six inch barrel and I cant imagine an inch making a huge difference in velocity, so I guess what Im asking is does the 6in barrel make sense for the handloader or can the same or virtually the same be done in 5in?
Another question. Has anybody used a DoctorOptics DoctorSight on their 10mm cannon (I mean a gun getting large volumes of max or exceeding pressure handloads, being subjected to carbine-like trajectory and muzzle energy) and not had it dissintegrate? The adds say rated for 500 gs but that tells me exactly nothing because while that is alot for a person, is it alot for a slide?
Thanks alot guys. If you ever stop by the local range, you can feel free to come over and shoot the gun and the bull.

You can expect a velocity increase of between 30 and 60 fps, depending on the load. I like a longer barrel for a multitude of reasons: Reduced slide velocity and recoil, as well as enhaced velocity and power.

Scott

Well many factors come into play...Type of powder especially because the slower types tend to burn better in the longer barrels and the faster powders burn more completely in less barrel length. Also the amount of the particular powder also. Barrel rifling type will also be a factor. Length too!

Having said that I have seen as much as 100 feet per second in 1" of difference in pistols, although I have seen as little as 20 feet per second.

Even with Double Tap I have seen these kinds of differences from the advertised velocities. Usually the heavier bullets use slower burn rates to obtain the velocities.

Best of luck!

I'm only able to judge from my own experience, but I've found that the CCI Blazer 200 gr ammo, rated @ 1050 fps from a 5" barrel clocks at (ave.) of 1040 fps from my Glock G20.
Also, I've seen tests of 10MM ammo from 10" & 14" TC Contender barrels, & due to case volume, there is virtually no gain in velocity after the 10" mark is reached. Differences in velocity after that point seem to be barrel variance, eg. no 2 guns shoot exactly alike. Some of the ammo used in the TC test was OLD Norma, so it definately was hot ammo.

uncle albert

Thanks guys. Im not gonna worry about a hundred feet per second, at least not when talking about 1300 or 1400 or 1600 feet per second.

As The Shadow had said, velocity differences can be either pronounced, or minimal. You may be surprised in what 100 fps can provide when it comes to energy development. When it comes to 100 fps difference between one load and another, I'd rather err on the side of more power. That's just in my never to be humble opinion.

Scott

If that's the case, why don't you just buy a .40 S&W and be done with it? There is an average difference of 100-200 feet per second between the two handgun rounds.

Don't be a member of the "sheeple" class... be yourself! This is one situation where being a "maverick" counts!

Scott

This post has been edited by gunfan: November 10th 2008 10:03 AM

It all really depends on the exact 5" and 6" barrels that you compare. I have a friend with a 5" 2011 gun in .40 and an otherwise identical 6" 2011. The 5" gun has a barrel that's on the fast side and the 6" has a barrel that's on the slow side. He gets the same velocity out of both of them....not the norm, but not uncommon.

The Doctor Sights are really neat, but they have had some failure issues. If you decide to get one, buy it from Beven Grams at Grams Engineering and he'll Bevenize it, which makes them much more durable. If I remember correctly it also gives you a better warranty. To add a little detail, Dean Makos (Doctor USA) imports them and he's good friends with Beven....and all of Dean's guns have Bevenized Doctor's on them. If the guy that imports them gets this done, it's probably a good idea!

I'm sorry if I sounded too abrasive. The point of owning the 10mm is to possess and employ a "higher performance" .40 caliber pistol (or revolver.) If you can handle the longer slide/barrel combination, it is generally to your advantage to do so. When I can afford to purchase it, a 6" Match barrel/slide for my Witness will "wend its way" to my door. I really appreciate both the longer sighting plane and additional ballistic efficiency that this arrangement provides. The Match barrel will also give me "the edge" in the field, as well as on the street. (I can bring a 6" pistol into acton VERY quickly!) Besides, the sight of a large handgun has a defininte psychological advantage... it scares the daylights out of the bad guys! If they see that you own (and carry) a custom pistol, more often than not, they generally are quite certain that you know how to use it! The added weight of the long slide/barrel reduces recoil and facilitates rapid shot recovery. This is EXTREMELY useful in a firefight!

With the Witness arrangement, a MINIMUM of 52 rounds will be at my disposal. This, along with about 1300 fps for either a 200-grain GDHP, or SP projectile will provide a potent response to a BG firing from an automobile! Let's face it, 745 fpe will cause the SP to quickly pass through a car door and ruin ANY malefactor's day! (Handily defeating automotive "safety glass" is always a plus!) If you are using 165-grain Double Tap ammunition (GDHP loads) you can be certain that 700+ fpe will "get the job done" no matter how thick of a jacket the thug is wearing! If you want to "stop the action" RIGHT NOW, under most circumstances, the faster the load is moving, the better! A 180-grain GDHP, smoking along at 1400 fps will penetrate his winter coat, blossom to a nice .65-.66" "mushroom" and tear the living daylights out of clothing, organs and tissue for a good 16-18 inches. Bone fragmentation, as well as tissue maceration, is virtually assured, and the bad guy goes down instead of ME! (Isn't that the object of the exercise?)

It works for me!



Scott

This post has been edited by gunfan: November 10th 2008 10:09 AM

A longer and heavier slide will actually increase muzzle flip. The extra weight of the longer barrel will help counteract that, but only so much. With any auto, the vast majority of flip comes from when the slide stops at the rear and transfers that energy to the rest of the gun and your hand. You can't go heavier on the recoil spring to counteract this or you'll wind up with a gun that short strokes and isn't reliable. The more weight in the slide, the more it's going to flip in your hand (all other things being equal). This is why 6" guns lost favor in IPSC (sort of the gold standard for rapid, accurate shots) until they started lightening slides to the point that they were as light or lighter than standard 5" guns. Now that they've got that sorted out 6" guns are extremely popular in Limited division because they give you the longer sight radius which helps shoot them accurately. The old style long slide guns seemed like a good idea, but they were sluggish in transition from one target to the next and they took longer to reset after each shot because of the added muzzle flip from the longer/heavier slide...think of a teeter-toter going up and down. R,

To a degree, that is true. If it is MY pistol, the longer slide/barrel will help me stabilze on target. I have been shooting longer than most "bad guys" and will probably come out on top during a firefight.

That's the place to remain, isn't it?

Scott