My favorite Double Tap brand load is the 165 grain Gold Dot load at 1,400 feet per second. This load expands to over an inch (2.5x bullet diameter) and penetrates 14.25 inches into clothed ballistical gelatin from a 5 inch barreled handgun! Wow! With over 740 foot pounds of muzzel energy, and passing the F.B.I.'s minimum penetration depth criteria of 12 inches, the 165 grain Gold Dot load is both impressive and potent.

My question is this... is it possible to engineer a load that could achieve at least .80 caliber expansion from a 4.25 inch barreled handgun, penetrate over 14.0 inches into clothed ballistical gelatin, and still generate the energies of a .45+P round, while having more managable recoil for quicker shot-to-shot recovery time?

The 10mm Auto round is exceptionally versatile. The heavier full power rounds are great for hunting medium sized game. The medium velocity rounds are great for all round defensive applications. And the reduced "F.B.I." rounds are suited to perform the task they were assigned, to penetrate and recoil much, much less. However, if one makes the 10mm to weak, that defeats the purpose of having a cartridge designed around performance and power. Therefore, my suggestion would be to have a load that balances both power and recoil management in a potent, yet controlable 10mm package. My suggestion is to have a comparative round to the .45+P, 165 grain at 1200 to 1250 fps.; or, to have a 180 grain round at 1125 to 1175 fps, with maximum penetration and expansion characteristics. Thank you.

I concur. This is why the 10mm is (or should be) so justly famous! Versatility. This cartridge can do more than 90-99% of all other autoloading catridges. I just wish the rest of the shooting public yould pull their collective heads out of their closets and realize how good the 10mm really is. Perhaps we could then get the gun manufacturers to revive what never should have waned.

Scott

This post has been edited by gunfan: August 19th 2007 11:59 AM

Medium Velocity Loads for 10mm!


When I read that, 40 short and weak popped into mind

Sorry I will live now and you can return to your normal braodcasting

lol... Yeah, I hear ya. I guess I just want to find the best of both worlds. I like the performance of the powerful loads, but have been spoiled by the shall we say more gentle ammo...lol. I guess one can't have his cake and eat it to. I was just hoping that there might be something with just a little bit more juice than the .40 S&W, without quite as much heavy recoiling as the full power rounds. Call me what you will...lol. That's ok.

I enthusiastically endorse IRmediator's proposal for DT to introduce medium power 10mm loads for self defense! I bought my G20 to carry when hiking, backpacking, and camping. (I am retiring my S&W M19 that I have carried for 35 years from woods duty.) My G20 will also do double duty as a home defense weapon and will be carried with me on road trips. I carry DT 200 gr. XTP and/or FMJ when I'm hiking and camping, but for other self defense situations, I would prefer a 155 gr. or 165 gr. load with a little less velocity and recoil than the loads DT currently offers.

If you look at the gelatin test results posted by DT, the 10mm loads give another inch or so of penetration along with a modest increase in expansion when compared to DT 40S&W loads of equal weight. I think an expansion diameter of .7" or more is adequate, so it certainly appears that for self defense purposes, DT 40S&W loads are definitely capable of delivering the required performance for most self defense situations.

For self defense purposes not involving black bear and cougar, full power 10mm loads are not needed. In such situations, full power loads deliver only a small advantage in terminal ballistics at the expense of more recoil and slower recovery time for additional shots. If a load delivers the required penetration and expansion (plus a little extra), why do we need to increase the velocity?

IRmediator's suggested loads sound just about perfect. Another good starting point might be to develop new DT 10mm loads which duplicate the velocities (or perhaps 50 fps more) of the DT 40S&W 155 gr. and/or 165 gr. loads. These loads deliver at least 100 fps more velocity than the 40S&W loads available from most other manufacturers, so you would still be getting high performance. Also, the newly introduced DT 10mm load with the Barnes XPB could be reduced in velocity by 100 to 150 fps. That bullet will deliver outstanding penetration and expansion at a lower velocity. The result would be a self defense load with lower recoil which would still deliver more velocity than the Corbon DPX 10mm load (and at a more affordable price.)

I know I can buy a 40 S&W barrel for my G20, but that seems like an unnecessary extra expense. There are also a few loads made by other manufacturers that come close to meeting the desired specs, but most use older JHP designs rather than the best available JHP bullets (like Gold Dot). And most other brands are only available in boxes of 20 at a cost of almost $1 per round (or more).

These suggested medium velocity loads would also make excellent practice loads. Most of my hand loads which I use for plinking and practice shooting at the range are loaded to the desired velocity level, but I prefer to carry factory loads for self defense.

I know DT built its reputation by providing high velocity and high quality 10mm loads. But in many situations, maximum velocity does not necessarily equal optimal performance in a self defense round. I learned long ago while hand loading for my .44 mag that you don't always need maximum velocity to get the job done.

Thanks to IRmediator for a good suggestion well stated. Are you listening Mike?

Thanks Zorba If you need more, you got a load that can give you more. If you want less, then there could be that option as well. It all is about personal preference. I love DT ammo!!!

"Me three", or something like that....the mo DT there is, tha betta.

Hell I'd even love a subsonic 200gr JHP from DT....A G20 with a can and a light is one of my fav indoor 'power tools' and I'd rather shoot McNett's stuff than anyone elses. My stock of Ranger 200gr Talon is vanishing, and I know DT stuff could improve on the performance.

After seeing my brass flung 30+ feet away out of of my 4.25" bbl (actually more) I begrudingly agree. However, I still want a 180 :)

This post has been edited by remat457: September 8th 2007 4:47 AM